Hey all! As most of you know I am now hydro free but it was easy compaired to getting off of valium. I was taking 20mg a day for a while, tapered to 15mg and went 1 week feeling fine. So I got balsy and cut to 10mg after a week and felt the effects of such a big cut the next day. I have read the ashton manual and know my cut was to big. So last night I uped my valium to 12.5 mg and today I feel a little better but still anxious and jittery, trouble sleeping. Eating is helping but I want this nightmare to end!
What should I do ??? I can't feel like this everyday or I will go insane. If I keep my dose to 12.5mg will that be the way to do it ?? Do I stay at 12.5 for 1 week or 2 weeks before cutting to 10mg ??
I know I could easily go home tonight, take 25mg of valium and feel great! But then I am back to the start and I feel I am making decent progress, its just long man. The suppliments do nothing, I am sleeping crappy and all I am thinking about is how to get off these damm pills.
I want to be down to at least 5mg of valium, luckily I got my order from Joe before all the seizers so I have like 60 of em 10mg so I should be set for a little while but I just can't get this taper thing down.
Any benzo experts I sure could use your advice.
At this point I am so pissed! I am not feeling horrible, but this anxious feeling all day and even at bedtime sucks! I'm lost now. I almost feel like ordering some hydro to get a boost back but I have gone so far on that now that I don't want to fall off the wagon after 4 weeks hydro free.
PLEASE HELP!!!!
I wish their was a suboxine for benzo's. getting of hydro was a cakewalk compared to this. At least I knew with hydro that if I stuck it out for 1 week I would be fine, plus I was taking 20mg of valium each day so that took care of my benzo addiction. Now I don't know what to do ???

I have only used benzos infrequently so I don't really know how you feel, but have you tried Kava Kava that is available in the health food stores? It is an effective natural tranquilizer.

Fannie

The only advice I can give you is to taper very slowly off of the valium. If you have been taking them for a long period of time and just stop you could go into seizures. Benzos are the hardest medication to stop so you have to be extremely careful if you run into any trouble you should be seen by a MD.

Just be very very careful and do it slowly.


Libby

tried every suppliment in the book. I am convinced their is no "Natures Valium", thats why their is prescription meds!
I guess I have no choice but to do it slowly, just wish this crappy feeling would end or their was something I could take besides hydro to feel better.
I'm almost ready to fall off the wagon and order some hydro but I doubt I will.

kramer,
I found this on the web. I am not sure if it will help you but I do hope it does.

Libby


THE WITHDRAWAL

(1) Dosage tapering. There is absolutely no doubt that anyone withdrawing from long-term benzodiazepines must reduce the dosage slowly. Abrupt or over-rapid withdrawal, especially from high dosage, can give rise to severe symptoms (convulsions, psychotic reactions, acute anxiety states) and may increase the risk of protracted withdrawal symptoms (see Chapter III). Slow withdrawal means tapering dosage gradually, usually over a period of some months. The aim is to obtain a smooth, steady and slow decline in blood and tissue concentrations of benzodiazepines so that the natural systems in the brain can recover their normal state. As explained in Chapter I, long-term benzodiazepines take over many of the functions of the body's natural tranquilliser system, mediated by the neurotransmitter GABA. As a result, GABA receptors in the brain reduce in numbers and GABA function decreases. Sudden withdrawal from benzodiazepines leaves the brain in a state of GABA-underactivity, resulting in hyperexcitability of the nervous system. This hyperexcitability is the root cause of most of the withdrawal symptoms discussed in the next chapter. However, a sufficiently slow, and smooth, departure of benzodiazepines from the body permits the natural systems to regain control of the functions which have been damped down by their presence. There is scientific evidence that reinstatement of brain function takes a long time. Recovery after long-term benzodiazepine use is not unlike the gradual recuperation of the body after a major surgical operation. Healing, of body or mind, is a slow process.

The precise rate of withdrawal is an individual matter. It depends on many factors including the dose and type of benzodiazepine used, duration of use, personality, lifestyle, previous experience, specific vulnerabilities, and the (perhaps genetically determined) speed of your recovery systems. Usually the best judge is you, yourself; you must be in control and must proceed at the pace that is comfortable for you. You may need to resist attempts from outsiders (clinics, doctors) to persuade you into a rapid withdrawal. The classic six weeks withdrawal period adopted by many clinics and doctors is much too fast for many long-term users. Actually, the rate of withdrawal, as long as it is slow enough, is not critical. Whether it takes 6 months, 12 months or 18 months is of little significance if you have taken benzodiazepines for a matter of years.

It is sometimes claimed that very slow withdrawal from benzodiazepines "merely prolongs the agony" and it is better to get it over with as quickly as possible. However, the experience of most patients is that slow withdrawal is greatly preferable, especially when the subject dictates the pace. Indeed, many patients find that there is little or no "agony" involved. Nevertheless there is no magic rate of withdrawal and each person must find the pace that suits him best. People who have been on low doses of benzodiazepine for a relatively short time (less than a year) can usually withdraw fairly rapidly. Those who have been on high doses of potent benzodiazepines such as Xanax and Klonopin are likely to need more time.

Examples of slow withdrawal schedules are given at the end of this chapter. As a very rough guide, a person taking 40mg diazepam a day (or its equivalent) might be able to reduce the daily dosage by 2mg every 1-2 weeks until a dose of 20mg diazepam a day is reached. This would take 10-20 weeks. From 20mg diazepam a day, reductions of 1 mg in daily dosage every week or two might be preferable. This would take a further 20-40 weeks, so the total withdrawal might last 30-60 weeks. Yet some people might prefer to reduce faster and some might go even slower. (See next section for further details).

However, it is important in withdrawal always to go forwards. If you reach a difficult point, you can stop there for a few weeks if necessary, but you should try to avoid going backwards and increasing your dosage again. Some doctors advocate the use of "escape pills" (an extra dose of benzodiazepines) in particularly stressful situations. This is probably not a good idea as it interrupts the smooth decline in benzodiazepine concentrations and also disrupts the process of learning to cope without drugs which is an essential part of the adaptation to withdrawal. If the withdrawal is slow enough, "escape pills" should not be necessary.

thanks libby, that looks like from the ashton manual. Easier to read here! guess I just got to take it slooooowwwww.
Maybe by summer I will be done!

Definately take it slow. This drug is nothing like hydro, which can be tapered much quicker. Just be safe..Oh..And it is an excerpt from the Ashton manual....

Libby

Kramer.....will the Tramadol help with the w/d's? I know you were taking it once in a while....have you stopped the Tramadol? I just remember how much you said it helped during the hydro w/d's. Just a suggestion.....Take care and hang in there.................Karli

Re: tramadol and valium:
I am no doctor but I do know from what I have read that taking tramadol can induce seizures, and discontinuing benzodiazepines can induce seizures. Therefore, it may be that taking tramadol while tapering from a benzodiazepine is a bad idea. Exactly how bad an idea it is probably depends on several factors, including dose of tramadol, dose of benzo, duration of use of both, and speed of benzo taper. I could be wrong, but this sounds like it could be risky business.

Hi Kramer,

I know you feel pretty bad right now but it will probably last just a few days maybe as many as 5. Every day you will feel a little bit better. When your body/brain adjust to the lower amount of valium you will feel and begin to sleep better. The trick is to stay at the 12.5mg dose for a few weeks before you reduce to 10. Once you get a "feel" for the adjustment cycle it will be easier. I know from experience it can be terrible to not know how long the shitty feeling, jitters, and insomnia will last and if it would even be possible to get off it at all. You can do it. It probably took you awhile to get to the dosage you were at so give your brain/body some time to adjust to not having those chemicals...a little at a time. At times I still would like to feel the warm fuzzies that benzos give me and I would use them if the consequences weren't so steep so I just avoid them altogether now. A couple of things that worked for me are sleepytime tea before bed, 3 capsules of valerian, and 200mg of theanine. Theanine is a non-essential amino acid that has remarkable calming properties and is found in green tea. I still use the herbal solutions today and awake without a hangover which is wonderful. There was a time when I was taking up to 10mg of xanax daily/nightly and 10mg of ambien nightly so I became well acquainted with insomnia during my withdrawal. I also recommend some kind of daily exercise like brisk walking at least 1/2 hour if you can. It really helps to clear the head and release the natural feel good chemicals our brains manufacture. Hang in there. It will get better as long as you stay the course adn even if you don't keep trying and you will eventually succeed.